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	<title>Comments on: Born A Sinner?</title>
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	<link>http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/2008/10/21/born-a-sinner/</link>
	<description>I will therefore that the younger women marry, bear children, guide the house, give none occasion to the adversary to speak reproachfully. 1 Timothy 5:14 (KJV)</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 28 Dec 2008 00:36:53 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Lacy Rebekah</title>
		<link>http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/2008/10/21/born-a-sinner/#comment-1013</link>
		<dc:creator>Lacy Rebekah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 12:59:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/?p=976#comment-1013</guid>
		<description>For all future commenters, please go to my new site:
http://lacy.obeyingthetruth.com/blog/

I have moved my blog! :)

~ Lacy</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For all future commenters, please go to my new site:<br />
<a href="http://lacy.obeyingthetruth.com/blog/" rel="nofollow">http://lacy.obeyingthetruth.com/blog/</a></p>
<p>I have moved my blog! <img src='http://s.wordpress.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>~ Lacy</p>
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		<title>By: Born A Sinner? Part 2</title>
		<link>http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/2008/10/21/born-a-sinner/#comment-974</link>
		<dc:creator>Born A Sinner? Part 2</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Nov 2008 01:34:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/?p=976#comment-974</guid>
		<description>[...] Born A Sinner? Part 2 [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Born A Sinner? Part 2 [...]</p>
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		<title>By: jacob1207</title>
		<link>http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/2008/10/21/born-a-sinner/#comment-914</link>
		<dc:creator>jacob1207</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Nov 2008 00:28:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/?p=976#comment-914</guid>
		<description>Hi, Lacy.  I like your blog.

I think that so many people think babies are sinful because they haven&#039;t really thought about the proposition--and what it says about God--for themselves; they just listen to what people tell them to think.

Infants have no decision-making capacity; they are not moral actors and cannot possibly commit an immoral act (or a moral act).  It&#039;s not possible for them to have committed a sin.  To say they&#039;re guilty of anything is as silly as having the cops show up in the delivery room to met your new infant with a ticket for speeding or a toddler being indicted by the Hague for committing war crimes.

Since you bring up the topic of the salvific status of the unborn, consider this: due to purely natural processes, only 40% of fertilized eggs result in a live birth (this is excluding all abortions).  So if all fertilized eggs are persons for purposes of salvation it would imply that, at a bare minimum, 60% of heaven&#039;s denizens will be people who were never even born.  If, that is, one considers personhood to be gained at the moment of fertlization.  Things are less worse if you push that back to when the egg implants in the uterus, but it still produces odd results.

I enjoy the backgrounds you&#039;ve made.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, Lacy.  I like your blog.</p>
<p>I think that so many people think babies are sinful because they haven&#8217;t really thought about the proposition&#8211;and what it says about God&#8211;for themselves; they just listen to what people tell them to think.</p>
<p>Infants have no decision-making capacity; they are not moral actors and cannot possibly commit an immoral act (or a moral act).  It&#8217;s not possible for them to have committed a sin.  To say they&#8217;re guilty of anything is as silly as having the cops show up in the delivery room to met your new infant with a ticket for speeding or a toddler being indicted by the Hague for committing war crimes.</p>
<p>Since you bring up the topic of the salvific status of the unborn, consider this: due to purely natural processes, only 40% of fertilized eggs result in a live birth (this is excluding all abortions).  So if all fertilized eggs are persons for purposes of salvation it would imply that, at a bare minimum, 60% of heaven&#8217;s denizens will be people who were never even born.  If, that is, one considers personhood to be gained at the moment of fertlization.  Things are less worse if you push that back to when the egg implants in the uterus, but it still produces odd results.</p>
<p>I enjoy the backgrounds you&#8217;ve made.</p>
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		<title>By: Kathleen</title>
		<link>http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/2008/10/21/born-a-sinner/#comment-868</link>
		<dc:creator>Kathleen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 03:58:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/?p=976#comment-868</guid>
		<description>Hello again Lacy!  I&#039;ve looked around your site a bit after I found your custom wallpaper page (I&#039;m the one who requested Isaiah 41:10), and it&#039;s great to see someone your age who cares about modesty and living a Godly life.  (That makes me sound really old to say &quot;someone your age&quot;, but I&#039;m only in my 20s!)  I just wanted to tell you that I&#039;m so glad that you wrote this post.  This doctrine is so clear from the Bible - babies are born innocent!  But for some reason the Christian world is confused about it.  You explain it simply and clearly, and I hope that people find this and read this so that they will understand that little babies are innocent and pure.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello again Lacy!  I&#8217;ve looked around your site a bit after I found your custom wallpaper page (I&#8217;m the one who requested Isaiah 41:10), and it&#8217;s great to see someone your age who cares about modesty and living a Godly life.  (That makes me sound really old to say &#8220;someone your age&#8221;, but I&#8217;m only in my 20s!)  I just wanted to tell you that I&#8217;m so glad that you wrote this post.  This doctrine is so clear from the Bible &#8211; babies are born innocent!  But for some reason the Christian world is confused about it.  You explain it simply and clearly, and I hope that people find this and read this so that they will understand that little babies are innocent and pure.</p>
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		<title>By: Maria Pauline</title>
		<link>http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/2008/10/21/born-a-sinner/#comment-866</link>
		<dc:creator>Maria Pauline</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 00:55:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/?p=976#comment-866</guid>
		<description>Like Jocelyn, I am still thinking on this. I have always been taught that children inherit a sinful nature from their parents. But whether that sinful nature means that newborns are sinners or not, I will have to research myself. 

However, I do know that I will trust in the goodness of the Will of God. 

But you have not mentioned baptism at all. I do believe it is related to this issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Like Jocelyn, I am still thinking on this. I have always been taught that children inherit a sinful nature from their parents. But whether that sinful nature means that newborns are sinners or not, I will have to research myself. </p>
<p>However, I do know that I will trust in the goodness of the Will of God. </p>
<p>But you have not mentioned baptism at all. I do believe it is related to this issue.</p>
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		<title>By: amberpeace</title>
		<link>http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/2008/10/21/born-a-sinner/#comment-854</link>
		<dc:creator>amberpeace</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 21:46:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/?p=976#comment-854</guid>
		<description>This disagreement is mainly why there will never be reconciliation to one whole Church again. That and that end of times thing. And Zwingli completely destroying the Eucharist doctrine. Okay, there are many things.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This disagreement is mainly why there will never be reconciliation to one whole Church again. That and that end of times thing. And Zwingli completely destroying the Eucharist doctrine. Okay, there are many things.</p>
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		<title>By: Donna (in Virginia)</title>
		<link>http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/2008/10/21/born-a-sinner/#comment-821</link>
		<dc:creator>Donna (in Virginia)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2008 22:01:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/?p=976#comment-821</guid>
		<description>Tracy, those who can sin, have sinned. That&#039;s what &quot;all&quot; means. Infants are incapable of sinning! The LORD Jesus spoke of sin as a voluntary act of the human will. &quot;Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant  of sin&quot;  Only after we sin, is it proper to say that we have a sinful nature. Babies are not born sinners, but as they grow up and learn right from wrong, they will sin. . . hence, all have sinned. 

They don&#039;t sin because Adam sinned.  You need to read Ezekiel 18:18-22. Blaming sin upon one&#039;s nature and not upon one&#039;s will, takes away all personal responsibility for sin and says God made you a sinner. That&#039;s blasphemy!  

God said to Jeremiah, &quot;Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.&quot;  (Jeremiah 1:5 KJV)

Of John the Baptist the Bible says, &quot;For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother&#039;s womb.&quot;  (Luke 1:15 KJV) 

The only thing mankind inhereted from Adam was &quot;Physical Death.&quot; &quot;So death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:&quot;(Romans 5:12 KJV)  Notice the only thing passed upon &quot;all&quot; men was &quot;DEATH.&quot; 

Sin is a criminal act against God. It Simply CANNOT be proven ANYWHERE in Scripture that human nature can be handed down, imputed or inherited as though sin was lodged in our flesh like some kind of disease. 

The doctrine of total depravity is a lie from Satan.  Sure, Satan wants you to believe that &quot;God made you this way,&quot; so you will not turn from your sin, because you think you can&#039;t do anything BUT SIN!  

Homosexual, drunks, adulterers, thieves and murderers have used this excuse throughout history also.  

Christians are called to perfection (Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.  Matthew 5:48 KJV) and if total depravity were true, this would be impossible! 

Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.  (1 Corinthians 15:34 KJV)  How can we be commanded to &quot;sin not&quot; if we don&#039;t have the ability to obey??

The early Christians and Anabaptists knew infants were innocent. Why do you think all the protests went on about infant baptisms against the Catholics?? Baptisms weren’t necessary as infants couldn’t choose to do good or evil. Sin is all about “choice” not physical makeup. Just ask Satan! He didn&#039;t have Adam&#039;s nature and he still sinned!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tracy, those who can sin, have sinned. That&#8217;s what &#8220;all&#8221; means. Infants are incapable of sinning! The LORD Jesus spoke of sin as a voluntary act of the human will. &#8220;Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant  of sin&#8221;  Only after we sin, is it proper to say that we have a sinful nature. Babies are not born sinners, but as they grow up and learn right from wrong, they will sin. . . hence, all have sinned. </p>
<p>They don&#8217;t sin because Adam sinned.  You need to read Ezekiel 18:18-22. Blaming sin upon one&#8217;s nature and not upon one&#8217;s will, takes away all personal responsibility for sin and says God made you a sinner. That&#8217;s blasphemy!  </p>
<p>God said to Jeremiah, &#8220;Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.&#8221;  (Jeremiah 1:5 KJV)</p>
<p>Of John the Baptist the Bible says, &#8220;For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother&#8217;s womb.&#8221;  (Luke 1:15 KJV) </p>
<p>The only thing mankind inhereted from Adam was &#8220;Physical Death.&#8221; &#8220;So death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:&#8221;(Romans 5:12 KJV)  Notice the only thing passed upon &#8220;all&#8221; men was &#8220;DEATH.&#8221; </p>
<p>Sin is a criminal act against God. It Simply CANNOT be proven ANYWHERE in Scripture that human nature can be handed down, imputed or inherited as though sin was lodged in our flesh like some kind of disease. </p>
<p>The doctrine of total depravity is a lie from Satan.  Sure, Satan wants you to believe that &#8220;God made you this way,&#8221; so you will not turn from your sin, because you think you can&#8217;t do anything BUT SIN!  </p>
<p>Homosexual, drunks, adulterers, thieves and murderers have used this excuse throughout history also.  </p>
<p>Christians are called to perfection (Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.  Matthew 5:48 KJV) and if total depravity were true, this would be impossible! </p>
<p>Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.  (1 Corinthians 15:34 KJV)  How can we be commanded to &#8220;sin not&#8221; if we don&#8217;t have the ability to obey??</p>
<p>The early Christians and Anabaptists knew infants were innocent. Why do you think all the protests went on about infant baptisms against the Catholics?? Baptisms weren’t necessary as infants couldn’t choose to do good or evil. Sin is all about “choice” not physical makeup. Just ask Satan! He didn&#8217;t have Adam&#8217;s nature and he still sinned!</p>
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		<title>By: Tracy Bunker</title>
		<link>http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/2008/10/21/born-a-sinner/#comment-820</link>
		<dc:creator>Tracy Bunker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2008 20:20:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/?p=976#comment-820</guid>
		<description>Lacy, I am going to have to disagree with you here as well. The Bible clearly states that man is fallen and depraved, because we all sinned in Adam. So let me ask you a few questions.

1.In your argument you stated that since we strive to be like Jesus, we are born perfect as well. But you and I were created by a man and a woman. Jesus was conceived of a virgin. That alone tells us that we can not even begin to be like Him. And are we to be crucified with Him? We were crucified in Him. But that does not tell us that we were perfect like him. I don&#039;t think that your argument here was valid. Are we born perfect and holy as our Savior? Because if we are, what sets him apart from us? What exactly makes Him holy and above us if we are as perfect as Him?

2.The Bible states that“ but all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.” You refuted this verse by telling us it says HAVE sinned, so that means you have committed some foul deed, so that deed labels you a sinner. I think we need to focus on the word ALL. When Jesus tells us ALL have sinned, He does not mean “ all (Not including the people that have not been born yet, of course. Because they didn&#039;t do anything wrong!) have sinned” So does all really mean all?

 I am guessing that you have never read the Doctrine of Total Depravity, and if you have the time and  inclination, please check it out on LazarusUnbound.com. My father is Michael Bunker and wrote this article on the subject. I am asking you as a friend to reconsider your understanding of this topic. 

Thank you.
Tracy Bunker</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lacy, I am going to have to disagree with you here as well. The Bible clearly states that man is fallen and depraved, because we all sinned in Adam. So let me ask you a few questions.</p>
<p>1.In your argument you stated that since we strive to be like Jesus, we are born perfect as well. But you and I were created by a man and a woman. Jesus was conceived of a virgin. That alone tells us that we can not even begin to be like Him. And are we to be crucified with Him? We were crucified in Him. But that does not tell us that we were perfect like him. I don&#8217;t think that your argument here was valid. Are we born perfect and holy as our Savior? Because if we are, what sets him apart from us? What exactly makes Him holy and above us if we are as perfect as Him?</p>
<p>2.The Bible states that“ but all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.” You refuted this verse by telling us it says HAVE sinned, so that means you have committed some foul deed, so that deed labels you a sinner. I think we need to focus on the word ALL. When Jesus tells us ALL have sinned, He does not mean “ all (Not including the people that have not been born yet, of course. Because they didn&#8217;t do anything wrong!) have sinned” So does all really mean all?</p>
<p> I am guessing that you have never read the Doctrine of Total Depravity, and if you have the time and  inclination, please check it out on LazarusUnbound.com. My father is Michael Bunker and wrote this article on the subject. I am asking you as a friend to reconsider your understanding of this topic. </p>
<p>Thank you.<br />
Tracy Bunker</p>
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		<title>By: Lacy Rebekah</title>
		<link>http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/2008/10/21/born-a-sinner/#comment-818</link>
		<dc:creator>Lacy Rebekah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2008 16:09:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/?p=976#comment-818</guid>
		<description>Dear &lt;b&gt;SaraBeth&lt;/b&gt;,
Thank you for commenting and giving us your thoughts on this issue! I appreciate it. :)

There is no lack of a common definition for sin, as 1 John 3:4 plainly gives us the definition of sin. Sin is the transgression of the law, not being contrary to God&#039;s nature. Let&#039;s keep it simple. If babies have not transgressed the law, have not sinned, then therefore they cannot be born sinners.

~ Lacy</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear <b>SaraBeth</b>,<br />
Thank you for commenting and giving us your thoughts on this issue! I appreciate it. <img src='http://s.wordpress.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>There is no lack of a common definition for sin, as 1 John 3:4 plainly gives us the definition of sin. Sin is the transgression of the law, not being contrary to God&#8217;s nature. Let&#8217;s keep it simple. If babies have not transgressed the law, have not sinned, then therefore they cannot be born sinners.</p>
<p>~ Lacy</p>
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		<title>By: SarahBeth</title>
		<link>http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/2008/10/21/born-a-sinner/#comment-817</link>
		<dc:creator>SarahBeth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2008 15:10:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://agodlymaiden.wordpress.com/?p=976#comment-817</guid>
		<description>I think most of the misunderstanding you are having stems from a lack of common definition for the term &quot;sin.&quot;
If, as I think you mean, you define sin as &quot;an act of disobedience to God,&quot;  then no, babies are not sinners.
If, however, you define it as &quot;being contrary to God&#039;s nature, which is only good&quot;  then yes, babies are sinful.  We, as humans can be nothing but contrary to God&#039;s nature until we repent and become believers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think most of the misunderstanding you are having stems from a lack of common definition for the term &#8220;sin.&#8221;<br />
If, as I think you mean, you define sin as &#8220;an act of disobedience to God,&#8221;  then no, babies are not sinners.<br />
If, however, you define it as &#8220;being contrary to God&#8217;s nature, which is only good&#8221;  then yes, babies are sinful.  We, as humans can be nothing but contrary to God&#8217;s nature until we repent and become believers.</p>
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